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The Failed Conservative Values of James Dobson

Written by: Edwin Rutsch on Jun 26, 2008 6:12 PM EDT

Linked to groups: East Bay for Democracy, Oakland DFA Meetup, Lake Park, San Francisco for Democracy, Alameda for Democracy, California for Democracy, Courage Campaign, Take Back Red California, Capitol Area Progressives (CAP) , What are Progressive Values? Study Group, DFA-Link Organizers, Walnut Creek DFA, Blog For America, Blogs United, DFA Film Club, DFA-Marin, DFA Night School, Silicon Valley DFA, brought to you by Dean Democratic Club of Silicon Valley, Framing Committee, Florida DFA, NJ for Democracy, Democracy for Florida, Democracy for New York, Democracy for Texas, Democracy for NYC, PA for Democracy, Democracy for Washington, Sacramento For Democracy, Democracy for Illinois, Democracy for Maryland, Philly for Change, Democracy for Ohio (DFO), Democracy for America Miami-Dade (DFAM), Washington Fair Elections, Michigan Democracy for America, DFALA

Religious factions will go on imposing their will on others unless the decent people connected to them recognize that religion has no place in public policy. They must learn to make their views known without trying to make their views the only alternatives.  Barry Goldwater




James Dobson is a major leader of the social conservatives. He is considered one of the more moderate of the 'Value Voters' leaders because he doesn't support spanking any child under the age of 18 months, while other conservative leaders do.

  
 I’m the conservative leader who can unite the party, John McCain

James Dobson  is now attacking Barrack Obama for "deliberately distorting the Bible" and "dragging biblical understanding through the gutter." Isn't it time for progressives to start unmasking how the values of  the conservative movement have failed? Isn't it time to ask them some questions about their failed values? How about asking your family,  friends, neighbors and colleges, "Have Conservative Values Failed?"

 Let's raise the question. It should be easy for anyone to answer.  It's time for progressives to take back the  values debate and promote an open and honest discussion about values.  Document what you find out and share it with the rest of us. 

Here are some progressives who have taken up the challenge.


Failed Conservative Values: Elaine Charkowski on Patriarchy Family Values
Failed Conservative Values: Elaine Charkowski - Patriarchy Family Values
Elaine Charkowski talked with me about how conservative values have failed. She says, Conservative Family Values is about patriarchy and fear of authority. It’s about not using your own mind and woman are to be subservient to the man. The type of power used is random punishment and reward, which studies show is the best way to drive animals crazy.
View @:Democracyforamerica.com  -  Opednews.com - Dailykos.com

 



Failed Conservative Values: Louise Specht on Hierarchy Authoritarian Narcissism
vstill-1vvow2WOhsg
I asked Louise Specht about the the failure of conservative values. She addressed the hierarchal and authoritarian nature of conservativism and how this can lead  to narcissism for the people at the top. Steven Colbert does a great job of imitating a conservative on the Colbert Report. I just saw him begin his show lately by saying, "Did I tell you I love me lately?"  He hit's the nail on the head, as does Louise.
View @:Democracyforamerica.com  - Opednews.com  -Dailykos.com - Groups.yahoo

 



Failed Conservative Values: Dona Ridgeway on Authoritarianism
Failed Conservative Values: Dona Ridgeway - Authoritarianism
Donna Ridgeway is a blogger living in the Santa Cruz, California area. She was raised republican and was in the military, but then started questioning. 
 She says the Failed Conservative Value is authoritarianism, it's a lose lose situation because if the authoritarian fails, everything fails. However she sees a lot of problems with progressives as well. There's a lot of egos with progressives and herding cats is hard.
View @: Democracyforamerica.com  - Opednews  - Dailykos - Groups.yahoo

 

 
Failed Conservative Values: Arianna Huffington on Family Values Hypocrisy
video
 Arianna Huffington is a well know progressive speaker and activist.  She started the popular Huffington Post website and it seems you can't turn on a progressive TV show  without her popping up on it and taking a swipe at the conservatives. I saw Arianna at our local bookstore where she was promoting her new book, The Right is Wrong. During the Q and A, I asked her how conservative values have failed. She had plenty to say. 
View @:Democracyforamerica.com  - Opednews.com  - Dailykos.com


 


 Failed Conservative Values: They're Not Working - George Lakoff
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George Lakoff is a linguistics professor at UC Berkeley and author of numerous books on metaphors, framing and politics. Howard Dean has called him, "one of the most influential political thinkers of the progressive movement." George was at our local bookstore talking about his latest book, The Political Mind. During the question and answer period, I asked him if he personally feels that Conservative Values have Failed and if so, how have they failed?
View @: Democracyforamerica.com  - Opednews.com - Dailykos.com




Failed Conservative Values: David Sirota on Economic Darwinism
video
David Sirota came and talked about his new book, 'The Uprising' at the Oakland Democracy for America meet-up on June 11, 2008.  During the Q and A, I asked David how conservative values have failed and he talked about the failure of Conservative Economic Darwinism. The full video of his 70 minute talk and slideshow is now online.
View @: Democracyforamerica.com -  Opednews.com - Dailykos.com

 


Attack of the Anaconda -  Failed Conservative Values Metaphors

Sometimes it helps to use a bit of  imagination and creativity to look at things in a different way to shake up the status quo and change mindsets.  I've been asking people to create a metaphor for the Failed Conservative Values.  For example, if conservative values were a type of machine, or land, or animal,  etc., what would they be like?    Here are some of the images people came up with; anaconda, meat grinder, quicksand and mud stuck elephant.
View @: Democracyforamerica.com - Opednews.com  - Dailykos.com 



Failed Conservative Values: Nancy Kops on Selfishness

I interviewed Nancy Kops and asked her about Failed Conservative Values and what are Progressive Values.  She feels caring is the most important liberal-progressive value.  She knows many conservatives and finds them to have good hearts and be very caring about the people around them. However, she can’t figure out why they can be attracted to the Republican Party. She thinks they just don't see the big picture.
View @: Democracyforamerica.com - Opednews.com - Dailykos.com

 


Failed Conservative Values: Arun Akkineni on Self-Righteousness

I interviewed Arun Akkineni about Failed Conservative Values. He felt that self-righteousness is a Failed Conservative Value and it's scary and dangerous. With self-righteousness, you see the world as black and white and don't see the nuances. You also don't incorporate other peoples ideas, which makes for poor decision making. He points to the current conservative administrations creation of the war and occupation of Iraq, as an example.
View @:DemocracyforAmerica.com - Opednews.com - Dailykos.com

 


Failed Conservative Values: Aris Harmon on Fear and Power

I interviewed Aris Harmon about the failure of conservative values.  He said conservatives can be very nice people but they try to maintain the status quo and are  afraid of change.  For this reason, their fear of change is easily manipulated by other conservatives such as, Grover Norquist and Abramoff, whose sole value is power at any cost.   He also sees the failure of critical thinking as the reason conservatives are so easily manipulated.
View @:DemocracyforAmerica.com  - Opednews.com - Dailykos.com



Failed Conservative Values: All about Greed

 I interviewed people around the Democracy for America booth at the California Democratic Party Convention in San Jose.  I asked people how have conservative values failed?  It surprised   me how many responded that the conservative value of greed was the biggest failure.   Here are some of the comments. 
View @:DemocracyforAmerica.com  - Opednews.com




Failed Conservative Values: Jim Dean on Corruption 

I interviewed Jim Dean, Chair of Democracy for America (DFA) at the  Democratic Party Convention in San Jose, California. I asked Jim how conservative values have failed. He says current conservativism is like a despotic dictator and is about corruption, power and the rewarding of friends. 
View @:DemocracyforAmerica.com  - Opednews.com - Dailykos.com




Failed Conservative Values: Norman Solomon on Dog Eat Dog Greed  

I interviewed Norman Solomon at the 2008 Democratic Party Convention in San Jose, California.  Norman  is a columnist and his book "War Made Easy"  was  recently made into a movie.  He talked about how he sees 'dog eat dog greed' as a Failed Conservative Value.
View @: DemocracyforAmerica.com - Opednews.com - Dailykos.com




Failed Conservative Values: Jeeni Criscenzo on Scapegoating

I interviewed Jeeni Criscenzo in Sacramento, California. Jeeni brought up the prevalent use of scapegoating by conservatives.  I find it curios how a Conservative Movement that preaches individual responsibility is so adept at finding scapegoats and not taking true responsibility. I think it has to do with the type of responsibility they preach. It is not the unqualified progressive sense of responsibility, where you feel responsible for yourself and the society around you, but rather conservatives always talk about a qualified 'individual responsibility' which actually is really no longer true responsibility, but rather a value of selfish self-centeredness. It's like taking the value of love or caring and saying we're for 'individual love' or 'individual caring'.  The values lose their meaning and are turned into nothing but the Failed Conservative Value of individual selfishness and greed.
View @: DemocracyforAmerica.com - Opednews.com - Dailykos.com

 


Failed Conservative Values: Barack Obama on the Status Quo v Change
video
In his Pennsylvania primary speech, Barack Obama talked about change and how the Status Quo resists change. As I interview people about what are Progressive Values and about how Conservative Values have Failed, the interviewees repeatedly talk about the conservative fear of change and the promotion of the status quo. We start off with this exploration of the Failed Conservative Value of the Status Quo with Barack Obama's speech on change versus the status quo.
View @:DemocracyforAmerica.com  - Opednews.com - Dailykos.com - Groups.yahoo

 


Progressive Values Stories: Brianna Leavitt on Taking Back Family Values - Justice & Responsibility

 I interviewed Brianna Leavitt at the First Congregational Church of Berkeley.  She feels conservatives have taken over the term Values and Family Values, but she doesn't want to just give up the words to them. She goes on to talk about the Progressive Values she learned in her family. Her mother always reached out to the poor and homeless.  Brianna  was taught empathy, justice and responsibility by her parents and grandmother. These are in opposition to the Failed Conservative Family Values that exclude people.
View @:DemocracyforAmerica.com  - Opednews.com - Dailykos.com - Groups.yahoo.com
 


Progressive Values Stories: Peter Harvey on Community versus Intolerance

I interviewed Peter Harvey at a Oakland, California Democracy for America meeting.  Peter  passionately talked about the progressive value of community and shared an early memory of the community reaching out to him.  However, he thinks that conservatives have completely missed the mark of religious teachings by going off into intolerance.
View @:DemocracyforAmerica.com  - Opednews.com - Dailykos.com

 


Failed Conservative Values:  Violence and Brutality
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This article is a rather harsh critique of deeper Failed Conservative Values.  In interviews, Richard Wagner told me he thinks thuggery is a failed conservative value and Herman Blackmon mentioned the lynch mob. I didn't think that either the lynch mob or thuggery were actually values. They seem more like manifestations of a value or perhaps of multiple values.
View @:DemocracyforAmerica.com  - Opednews.com - Dailykos.com - Groups.yahoo

 


Failed Conservative Values: Barbara, Carole, Nina on Dogmatism
vstill-fPotEtudDjI
 I'm starting a new series of articles on how Conservative Values have Failed.   It's obvious that conservative ideas and policies have failed, but the failures go even deeper to the very heart and essence of the conservative movement, to their Failed Conservative Values. In this series, we will pull back the mask of Conservative Family Values, Conservative Traditional Values,  individual freedom, individual responsibility, individual liberty, Compassionate Conservativism, etc. to reveal the underlying Failed Conservative Values of fear, authoritarianism, secrecy, dogmatism, greed, indifference, self-righteousness, arrogance, hypocrisy, etc.
View @:DemocracyforAmerica.com  - Opednews.com - Dailykos.com - Groups.yahoo


And There are more stories to come:
 

James Dobson at Wikipedia,
James Dobson  is an American evangelical Christian and chairman of the board of Focus on the Family, a nonprofit organization he founded in 1977....  As part of his role in the organization, he produces the daily radio program Focus on the Family, which is broadcast in more than a dozen languages and on over 7,000 stations worldwide, and heard daily by more than 220 million people in 164 countries, according to Focus on the Family's own statements.  ..... He is an evangelical Christian  with conservative views on theology and politics. He was recently named "The Most Influential Evangelical Leader in America" by Christianity Today magazine, and Slate has termed him the successor to evangelical leaders Billy Graham, Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson.

Some Questions for Discussion:

How have conservative values failed?
Ask your friends,  what do they say?
 


Failed Conservative Values
Assist us  in systematically building the arguments and telling the stories that reveal how Conservative Values have Failed. Join in our effort to create a documentary and book on the subject by contributing  articles, posts, chapters for the book and video clips. Check our website for more information and a growing outline of tasks that need to be done on this project. 
 

See more Progressive Values Stories:


Edwin Rutsch
What Are Progressive Values? Documentary Project
http://ProgressiveSpirit.com 
and Study Group
 

 

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- H.D. is. first.

By Karen on Jun 27, 2008 12:16 PM EDT
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- You sound like a fan.

By Tom Bearse on Jun 27, 2008 12:25 PM EDT
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- Dobson ...

By * rdorgan on Jun 27, 2008 12:27 PM EDT
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- ... just another angry man

By * rdorgan on Jun 27, 2008 12:28 PM EDT

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/frank-schaeffer/dr-dobson-has-just-handed_b_108989.html

Dr. Dobson Has Just Handed Obama Victory

Posted June 24, 2008 | 05:33 PM (EST)

Senator Obama just took another giant step toward winning the presidency. Actually, someone who considers himself a sworn enemy of Senator Obama took the step for him. Dr. Dobson of the Focus On the Family radio program (and evangelical media empire) has aired a program in which he attacks Senator Obama, the Senator's theology and his credentials as a Christian. With enemies like this Senator Obama doesn't need friends.

No, I'm not talking about Dobson energizing liberal Democrats. I'm talking about Dobson energizing his fellow evangelicals to vote for Senator Obama.

...
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- Pick a Meme, Any Meme

By Karen on Jun 27, 2008 12:31 PM EDT

As a rule, Republicans appreciate the value in defining the Democratic presidential nominee, and the GOP is usually pretty good at it. In 2000, Al Gore, they said, was an "exaggerator." This was not only effective, thanks to a quick embrace by the media, it was also part of a narrative -- when Gore takes credit for some of the successes of the '90s, don't believe him because he exaggerates.

In 2004, John Kerry, they said was a "flip-flopper." This, too, was relatively effective, and was once again parroted by the media. The narrative here was equally clear -- in the first post-9/11 election, in a time of war, we don't want someone who's inconsistent. Four years later, the effort to define Barack Obama is proving to be more difficult for Republican attack dogs. The GOP keeps experimenting with new memes, but not only are they not sticking, some even contradict each other.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/steve-benen/pick-a-meme-any-meme_b_109586.html

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By Karen on Jun 27, 2008 1:01 PM EDT

Dobson would fall under the 'Pick a Meme'...

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- Just got through with Gerry L's thread last...

By Annilow on Jun 27, 2008 12:49 PM EDT

...read those of interest to me. Thanks Gerry L for the great roundup. I hope Addington and/or Yoo travel outside of USA at some point and get arrested for war crimes. Those guys are the personification of evildoers imo. Also, I was thinking - McClatchy - online anyway - seems to be supported by advertising. Maybe DFA could purchase an ad on their site to give them some support -- they are really working to get at the truth.

Don't forget the Obama/Hill thing supposedly at 1 ET on CSPAN.

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- take the Dobson Failed Conservative Values Poll

By Edwin Rutsch on Jun 27, 2008 12:53 PM EDT

 http://www.opednews.com/Poll/Worst-of-the-Failed-Conser-by-Edwin-Rutsch-080627-245.html 

What is the worst of the Failed Conservative Values that James Dobson exemplifies?

take the poll here;
 http://www.opednews.com/Poll/Worst-of-the-Failed-Conser-by-Edwin-Rutsch-080627-245.html 

(  ) authoritarianism
(  ) fear
(  ) secrecy
(  ) dogmatism
(  ) corruption
(  ) greed
(  ) selfishness
(  ) indifference
(  ) self-righteousness
(  ) intolerance
(  ) division
(  ) hierarchy
(  ) Patriarchy
(  ) arrogance
(  ) scapegoating
(  ) fundamentalism
(  ) hypocrisy
(  ) Violence and cruelty
(  ) all of the above
(  ) other (please specify)

 

my vote   ( x ) all of the above

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- Clear Channel bans ads

By Karen on Jun 27, 2008 12:48 PM EDT

Clear Channel, the radio station and billboard powerhouse, has banned an ad for Harry Shearer's new CD "Songs of Bushmen" because it depicts George Bush with a bone through his nose, the New York Post's Page Six reports:

The outdoor advertising arm of notoriously conservative Clear Channel has banned signs for "Songs of the Bushmen" because the cover depicts the president with a bone through his nose. "Their tone turned from genial salesperson to angry schoolmarm - 'This is unacceptable,' " Shearer, the voice of Mr. Burns and Flanders on "The Simpsons," told Page Six. "And it's not like this is a dangerous time to criticize George Bush."

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By Annilow on Jun 27, 2008 12:54 PM EDT

PS Did everyone see the article on Huffpost about Lara Logan and her 'steamy' side?  Supposedly how she was in a love triangle with some married dude and on the side I guess had an affair with Michael Ware?  Well, then there was a diary on KOS wondering if the 'smear' on Lara was being propagated by those who would just as soon she not report the war so well.  The latter makes a lot more sense than the former.  Actually the former makes a lot of sense too -- she's a cutie and I've heard that danger is a great aphrodesiac.  Problem is it's really none of our d* business.

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By Huron John on Jun 27, 2008 1:02 PM EDT

Exactly...........

Her take on the woeful reporting from Iraq is very credible, and if she enjoyed a little action there, more power to her

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- Thanks to Jim & DFA

By Bob (NJ for Democracy) on Jun 27, 2008 1:05 PM EDT

for making Linda Stender a DFA-List candidate today. She came within 1% of winning the district two years ago against an incumbent, and now with better name recognition (thanks mostly to said incumbent, LOL), she's running for an open seat.

Linda has had continuous contact with New Jersey for Democracy, Hunterdon County DFA and Somerset County DFA. We're having two events for her this weekend. This is a tough district for progressive Democrats, but we can do it.

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- FISA Fun on the Fourth of July

By Huron John on Jun 27, 2008 1:20 PM EDT

http://firedoglake.com/2008/06/27/fisa-fun-on-the-fourth-of-july/

Chris Dodd and Russ Feingold succeeded in giving us a gift: no FISA votes in the Senate until July 8th -- after the Fourth of July recess. That means that when all the Senators go home for the holidays, to ride in those parades, you have a chance to be seen and heard. Not by the intern who downloads and counts the emails, not by the staffer who answers the phones and logs the calls, but by the Honorable Senator.

In person, face to face.

In public, where they can't turn away.

In front of the cameras, everywhere they look. 

Let me ask you this: are you ready for those reporters and photo journalists? Are you ready to see your Senator, should your parade be one in which the Senator will appear? 

If you have a place reserved for a float in your town's parade, maybe you need an idea for your decorations. If you have a place reserved for your lawn chair or the curb, maybe you need an idea for the sign you'll hold up when the Senator or Representative comes by.

"Hey Senator, can I have some immunity, too? -- Vote NO on FISA!"

"I like the WHOLE Bill of Rights -- Vote NO on FISA!"

You've come to the right place.

Floats have to be visual, signs have to be succinct, and chats with reporters have to be direct and to the point. I know from the comments around here that a lot of people hang out at the Lake who are good with images and with catchy phrases -- now's your chance.

"No warrant = no search -- Vote NO on FISA!"

"Accountability NOW -- No telecom immunity!"

"Dodd and Feingold are right -- Vote NO on FISA!"

The floor is open for additional sign suggestions, conversation-starters with the folks sitting next to you, and float ideas as well. What will you tell your Senator, if you should see them next week? (You can, of course, continue to let your views be heard in their offices . . . )

After all, what could be a more patriotic way to celebrate the Fourth of July than to stand up for the Constitution?

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By Annilow on Jun 27, 2008 3:17 PM EDT

VERY GOOD IDEA -- OUR PARADE IS ALWAYS HOT AS H BUT I WILL GO AND TAKE A SIGN.  

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- The Real McCain

By Huron John on Jun 27, 2008 1:31 PM EDT

http://www.truthout.org/article/the-real-mccain

 Welcome to the John McCain show 2008. It's powerful stuff, portraying McCain as the decent patriot of the middle ground and a steady hand for difficult times. For a lot of Americans - including many Democrats - it is a beguiling vision. They see a war hero whose courage was forged in a North Vietnamese POW camp. They see a maverick who spoke against the tortures of Abu Ghraib. They see a reformer who acts against lobbyists and political favours. They see a politician who has spent a lifetime serving his country and won a place in the hearts of the nation.

But there is another, very different side to John McCain. Away from the headlines and the stirring speeches, a less familiar figure lurks. It is a McCain who plans to fight on in Iraq for years to come and who might launch military action against Iran. This is the McCain whose campaign and career has been riddled with lobbyists and special interests. It is a McCain who has sided with religious and political extremists who believe Islam is evil and gays are immoral. It is a McCain who wants to appoint extreme conservatives to the Supreme Court and see abortion banned. This McCain has a notoriously volatile temper that has scared some senior members of his own party. If McCain becomes the most powerful man in the world it would be wise to know what lies behind his public mask, to look at the dark side of John McCain.

But the true McCain is far different. His dark side is real and Democrats will need to expose it if America is to avoid a third successive term of extreme conservative government. Now Democrat activists are pushing out their argument that McCain is a conservative wolf in a moderate sheep's clothing. They are highlighting the temper, the pro-war ideology and the links to lobbyists. 'We think he just means four more years of Bush,' says Karen Finney, a director at the Democratic National Committee. Finney's job is to convince Americans they have got McCain wrong, that they have been fooled. She and her fellow activists have less than four months to succeed. But for now, as America gears up to one of the most important elections in its history, McCain's dark side remains largely hidden behind closed doors.

 

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- The ideal Commute

By Huron John on Jun 27, 2008 1:35 PM EDT
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- LMFAO

By mainefem on Jun 27, 2008 3:20 PM EDT

...and I thought that *I* was frugal!

 

Great one, John~thank 'ya kindly.

 

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- Embracing Big Brother

By Huron John on Jun 27, 2008 1:46 PM EDT

http://www.counterpunch.org/cohn06272008.html

It may be June, but Christmas came early this year for Big Brother and the telecommunications giants. Unfortunately, it is average Americans who will pay--dearly--on three separate counts.

First, precious constitutional and other legal protections against warrantless domestic surveillance have been shattered.

The second price that Americans will pay is by those who have been illegally monitored since 9/11. They will lose billions of dollars from dozens of anti-spying lawsuits pending against the likes of Sprint, AT&T and Verizon. These suits, covering the last seven years, will now be dismissed in a huge giveaway of immunity to the telecommunications lobby and big campaign donors.

Third, Americans will be unable to discover the extent and details of the government's post-9/11 domestic spying operation, which barely came to light three years ago. That domestic eavesdropping campaign will now continue and expand further--with legal sanction--in the dark recesses of total secrecy. The new bill is a huge and blatant cover-up.

DEMOCRATS HAD claimed to be against the bill for months, but--as they did with the earlier USA PATRIOT Act--easily and completely capitulated. The new legislation received overwhelming bipartisan support in the U.S. House of Representatives on June 19; its imminent approval by the Senate is a foregone conclusion.

Reversing himself along with so many of his colleagues, Barack Obama gave fresh evidence of what can be expected of him if he wins the presidency.

At a time when Democrats are most ascendant--when Republicans, the war and bogus post-9/11 "national security" scams for gutting constitutional rights have been most discredited--Obama and "bipartisan" Democrats are giving the completely weakened Bush administration exactly what it wants. Why? There can be only one reason. It is what they want, too.

 

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By seashell on Jun 27, 2008 2:06 PM EDT

I see it's trash Huron day. Only a few of us are standing up to the ga-ga- worship of some on this blog. For pete's sake, what's more important than our rights? And why can't we start impeachment at the same time that we kill FISA? And why in the world would anyone think that BO, after his terrible performance lately, even bother to go after bushco if he were prez? What reality are some of you living in? A few of you keep pushing the goalposts,giving him passes...this is a big mistake. I've written and called and leaned on him...all I get from him are letters asking for money.

He has no intention of filibustering, does he?

IMO he's selling out the country in exchange for the ILLUSION of power...another puppet.

And Keith apparently is listening to his masters. Somebody wants BO to be prez very very badly. It's not the little donors who are handling Keith.

So who's really backing BO?

Very troubling indeed.

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By Huron John on Jun 27, 2008 2:48 PM EDT

I didn't see any trash remarks Sea. The lack of response is OK with me

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By Huron John on Jun 27, 2008 2:56 PM EDT

The regulars here have certainly learned that ignoring me won't make me go away!

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By seashell on Jun 27, 2008 2:08 PM EDT

BROKERED CONVENTION.

Dean/Feingold   ..... one can hope

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By FormerT on Jun 27, 2008 2:18 PM EDT

 

Ron Paul

By Shirlee Murphy on Jun 27, 2008 12:44 PM

Sorry, FormerT--Ron Paul--my rep--holds NO common ground with Democrats in the area of concern for the population her purports to represent.  He is very up-front about this--he will NEVER work for, support or vote for things like social security, medicare, head start etc--and he has NOT done a good job of keeping on top of problems in his district. 

----------------------------

Thanks, Shirlee.

By Tom Bearse on Jun 27, 2008 12:55 PM

I don't think T is buying it, but I'm glad you come here to emphasize it.

******************

No doubts I’m not buying it, Tom.    I can’t buy confusions.

Yes, Ron Paul has NEVER worked for, supported or voted for things brought by Government, by State.   And always supported things brought by People themselves.

Apparently it is still a long way ahead to come up with the realization that current institution of [professional] political leaderships IS an idolization of humans OVER other humans who have written themselves off as incapable to self-governance and self-control. 

Do we, the People, need LAWS written for us by [lifetime professionals] because otherwise we WON’T BE ABLE TO BEHAVE?

Do we, the People need ORDER setup for us by police and army because otherwise we WILL FALL INTO CHAOS?

Do we, the People need TO IDOLIZE someone else first and then TO FOLLOW that idol until our own and our life full and complete destruction?

Do we, the People really not capable to live as humans but still as slaves?

Every single one of us and all we, the People together ARE how we see ourselves.    Ron Paul respects us and sees us as humans.    Is he ahead of time?

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- Ron Paul

By Shirlee Murphy on Jun 27, 2008 7:47 PM EDT

The problem with the first half of this argument is that Ron Paul does not recognize the PEOPLE as a COMMUNITY--responsible to each other.

The latter half--what you see as IDOLIZATION most of us would recognize as LEADERSHIP. 

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- Expectations

By audrey.nc on Jun 27, 2008 2:52 PM EDT

We all know that both candidates have to be seen by the Corps that they are willing to play ball. That's the way it still is. The Corps will give to both parties. So, we know that Obama is acceptable to them if not their choice.
The only choice we have, is to keep a list of any disagreements, and haul it out after a period of observation. If he's going too much in the wrong direction, we can start complaining.
We have no choice but to get him elected, but in order to do that, it is counter productive to be pointing out reasons voters shouldn't vote for him.
In spite of the polls, if there is an incident at home, or an escallation of the war into Iran, this won't be a cakewalk. Voters are slow to complain, scare quickly.and easily. We shouldn't be lulled into thinking that they won't be fooled again. Fear works.

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By Annilow on Jun 27, 2008 3:13 PM EDT

Audrey who's the Corps?

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By Huron John on Jun 27, 2008 3:43 PM EDT

Corp[oration]s

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By Huron John on Jun 27, 2008 3:42 PM EDT

The repugs are in dissaray and full retreat Audrey. The only thing that will turn voters towards McCain is the perception of cynical manipulation by the Democrats. Things are so bad, that the Dems should sweep the election across the board if they're honest with the electorate. There's just too much Clintonesque "triangulation going on now, and we didn't see that side of Bubba 'til after he was elected (with a lot of help from Perot).

 

I agree that fear works.

 

What doesn't work is mindless devotion to flawed candidates.

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- The Decline of the Press

By Huron John on Jun 27, 2008 2:55 PM EDT

http://www.counterpunch.org/lind06272008.html

A person my age has watched many things decline in America, and few get better. As one of my neighbors says, everything good is gone or going. In that category we must now include good reporting. When I started work in Washington in 1973, it was axiomatic that a newspaper reporter talked to many sources for any story. The story, in turn, reflected a number of viewpoints and perspectives. No reporter worth his bourbon would have dreamed of just printing some press release put out by the government.

But that is now what they all seem to do, especially in covering the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. Forgetting that the phrase "to lie like a bulletin" is military in origin the reference is to bulletins issued by Napoleon's grande armeé -- they print verbatim the happy talk the U.S. military is obliged by the Bush administration to spew.

What lies behind the decline in the quality of American reporting? Cutbacks in the size of newsrooms are part of the answer. As the electronic image replaces the printed word, newspapers are dying. To those who know that perceiving reality requires more than shadows on the cave wall, that is bad news.

Lazy reporters are another part of the answer. It is easy to print the bulletins. Reporters have always been lazy, but now their editors let them get away with it. Not too many decades ago, any reporter who single-sourced a story would have been sent back on the street to get more sources, with a richness of invective editors seldom lacked.

But the biggest reason, I suspect, is intellectual cowardice. After the defeat in Vietnam, many supporters of the war blamed the press for our failure. By printing the bad news, the press supposedly undermined popular support for the war and thereby caused our defeat. It's poppycock, of course. The Vietnam War was lost early in the game when MACV, at the demand of General William Depuy, ordered an end to efforts to control the populated coastal lowlands in favor of fighting formal battles against enemy main force units in the highlands. Those units were sent there as bait, which MACV took.

But the American press was scarred by the accusations. Now, it is afraid to be accused of "not supporting the troops" if it does anything but print the bulletins. So the American public gets the mushroom treatment, and two failed wars continue ad infinitum. When the roof falls in both in Iraq and in Afghanistan, the shock will be considerable. America's yellow press will deserve no small share of the blame.

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By Annilow on Jun 27, 2008 3:12 PM EDT

Lara Logan, Michael Ware, McClatchy, and pro Publica seem to be trying.  Send $uv.

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- Friday WUFT FM Giveaway and Request Trivia Question...

By Annilow on Jun 27, 2008 3:08 PM EDT

...at Mahler's death, his work was largely ignored. But in the late 50s early 60s two conductors were instrumental in restoring it to its rightful place. Name the two conductors. I think Bernstein was one but don't know the other. Anyone? I'll go with von Karajan.

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By Annilow on Jun 27, 2008 3:10 PM EDT
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- Huron John

By audrey.nc on Jun 27, 2008 5:15 PM EDT

I didn't see your reply till now. I agree with the vetting right up until the GE starts. What to do now? There's no info comparable to Bush history. An upset at the convention would bring about a loss in Nov. Compared to Bush, he's great. We're not going to get everything in one election, so let's take this one step at a ime and use this election to rid ourselves of the Repubs in the WH, and maybe a break down of the Clinton hold on the Party, and elect a candidate who will probably accomplish some good things, Mccain can't be allowed in the WH. Many share your concerns, I do, but we need to get what we can, when we can, and keep at it.

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