Eightball says "Dean is first."

Howard principles rule.

Jo left us the definitive word with that filmstrip at the end of the last thread. I'll leave further discussion back there

but here is another link

http://www.acr.org/MainMenuCategories/media_room/FeaturedCategories/Videos/cy_colonography.aspx

Denise wrote "Linda NM threw the term out first Phil - directly at Tom."

Thanks for that clarification, Denise, but Linda has never called me that, and I did not want to imply that she did.  That was her reaction to a post by rdorgan.  I'm afraid those two do not get along terribly well.

lol Phil!

http://www.filmstripinternational.com/

The Financial Tines questions Hillarys sincerity.

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/758526dc-e877-...

OK -- gotta give this one to Linda NM and Seashell-guess we were wrong about the guy walking on water? I'll go check Obama factcheck and see what they are saying.

Obama, Canada, NAFTA, and false idols
by dhonig [Subscribe]

Mon Mar 03, 2008 at 05:28:38 AM PST

Okay folks, it is time for some serious retrospection. Last week CTV broke a story that Obama was playing both sides, telling Ohio he would renegotiate or quit NAFTA, but telling Canada "don't worry, be happy, it's just politics." Here on Daily Kos, though, nobody could believe Obama was actually a politician, rather than a new honest perfect phenomenon. So how did you all respond? By attacking the messenger. Well, folks, the messenger was right. The AP, you see, has the Canadian Government memorandum laying out what happened. So what happened, and what happened here? And what does it mean?

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/3/3/7...

Here is a link to the NAFTA Canada controversy.  According to some blogs Bill Clinton was in Toronto yesterday, I find that interesting to say the least.  This story has been out awhile, and suddenly the day before primaries it resurfaces.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080303/ap_on_el_pr/democrats_nafta

Also the original story had Clinton involved, now there is no mention of that.

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On 60 minutes the fellow who had lost his job and said he was undecided who to vote for because he had heard Obama would not pledge, and that he was a Muslim, he still was leaning towards Obama. 

Oops sorry Tom! It's still early here, not quite awake.

I know she called someone that, just had the wrong name. But she still did it, which surprised me very much. No apology from her yet, either.

Nothing new on Obama factcheck - their entry is dated Feb 28.

http://tinyurl.com/ywt5em

I'll go check politico.

Darn I can't get Jo's link to open - says it can't find the site. Mac not cooperating this morning I guess.

Yes, s m, which shows the fellow in OH at least has an open mind and heart. BTW, I liked Obama's response to Kroft *Did you tell him the truth, Steve?* Also, he said it wasn't fair to Muslims.

Iiya

Thanks for your contribution. I worked briefly as a prison counselor after college, and changing the behavior of an addict, or someone with a personality disorder, is difficult work. Being in a prison is eye opening even if you go home at night. Most people in prison earned the right to be there but why?

Howard Dean approached it the right way with "Success by Six" because that is the best long term approach, and most crime is committed by young people unable to succeed when on the street for the first time.They were neglected as youngsters, and then prison is just training in a culture that is very heirarchical, and someone finally "looks after" them and not to their long term benefit, hence the recidivism.

middle school is the last chance to create a path not on someones rap sheet, few commit their first crime after 25, society can't let dangerous people run around loose, it is one reason I feel so strongly that health care is a right, and mental health care demands parity, and the savings in our prison costs could pay for it

There are three Muslim families in my apt building. I make sure to give them an extra smile and a bit of conversation so they feel more welcome, not less, given all of the negative connotations their religion stirs up in this country since 9/11.

And to have it show up as a "negative" once again when we are about to elect the next president is just beyond the pale. How sad.

Nothing on politico so I checked Google news. Here's a para from MSNBC First Read

Oh, Canada: In what feels like a Perry Mason moment, the Obama campaign is going to have a hard time somehow claiming their chief domestic policy adviser was meeting with the Canadians as a University of Chicago professor and not as an Obama emissary. The only thing the Obama campaign can be happy about is that this memo of the meeting leaked today and not three days ago when the Clinton campaign could have spent days harping on this. This really does hit the Obama campaign on credibility when it comes to the press corps and may hurt them on another story down the road. The press corps gave the Obama camp the benefit of the doubt on this story; it won't next time. Of course, we have another question: Why is the conservative Canadian government leaking this memo and getting involved in a Democratic primary race?

http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2...

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Check that last sentence.

Remember what those ditto heads did to the Dixie Chicks.

the good news is that rove has already sorted out all of the clueless haters into the other Party so they won't effect our Primary

Yes, Denise. Why is being Muslim somehow negative? Because Bush and his cronies started down this path. Just awful. We have very dear Muslim friends so this really hits us personally. Being a Muslim does not equal being a terrorist. Sigh...

It is clear that someone from the Obama circle did contact the Canadians so I guess we would have one of those rare Obama mis-steps. A full disclosure would show few differences between Clinton and Obama on trade. Certainly no advantage Clinton.

bbl -- I fear this Nafta story may have legs -- what was someone saying the other day about Nedra Pickler? She seems to be the one reporting.

Annilow wrote "OK -- gotta give this one to Linda NM and Seashell-guess we were wrong about the guy walking on water?"

I hear it repeated often here that no candidate is perfect but, regardless of that, I fail to see the controversy surrounding the dKos diary with respect to the meeting between Goolsbee and Canadian consulate officials in Chicago.  The diary link is to an AP story entitled Obama Adviser Denies Trade Remarks, which states in part:

"Barack Obama's senior economic policy adviser said Sunday that Canadian government officials wrote an inaccurate portrayal of his private discussion on the campaign's trade policy in a memo obtained by The Associated Press.

" . . . .

"Goolsbee disputed a section that read: ''Noting anxiety among many U.S. domestic audiences about the U.S. economic outlook, Goolsbee candidly acknowledged the protectionist sentiment that has emerged, particularly in the Midwest, during the primary campaign. He cautioned that this messaging should not be taken out of context and should be viewed as more about political positioning than a clear articulation of policy plans.''

"'This thing about "it's more about political positioning than a clear articulation of policy plans," that's this guy's language,'' Goolsbee said of DeMora. ''He's not quoting me.

'''I certainly did not use that phrase in any way,'' Goolsbee said.

" . . . .

"[Goolsbee] said the visit lasted about 40 minutes, and perhaps two to three minutes were spent discussing NAFTA. He said the Canadians asked about Obama's position, and he replied about his interest in improving labor and environmental standards, and they raised some concerns that Obama sounds like a protectionist.

"He said he responded that Obama is not a protectionist, but that the Illinois senator tries to strike a balance between the economic struggles of working Americans and recognizing that free trade is good for the economy.

'''That's a pretty ham-handed description of what I answered,' Goolsbee said of memo's account. ''A: In no possible way was that a reference to NAFTA. And B: In no possible way was I inferring that he was going to introduce any policies that you should ignore and he had no intention of enacting. Those are both completely crazy.'

" . . . .

"Obama spokesman Bill Burton said Goolsbee's visit was not as an emissary from the campaign, but as a professor from the University of Chicago. He was not authorized to share any messages from the campaign, Burton said.

"Burton, who was on the call while Goolsbee described his visit to the AP, said, ''It all boils down to a clumsy, inaccurate portrayal of the conversation.''

"Asked if he agreed with Burton, Goolsbee said he did."

Hillary was wrong about not contesting TX. From the Burnt Orange Report - here's why:

http://www.burntorangereport.com/showDia...

The Republicans in TX are nervous about November. Howard's 50 state strategy is spot on and Barack is proving it.

I will say one thing - I don't trust this Goolsbee guy and I have to thank Seashell and Linda NM for pointing out some of his rather negative traits. I wish Obama had never jumped in the political bed with him. Just a feeling I have.

I fear this Nafta story may have legs

If you want to know if a story has legs, just turn on your TV. If it has legs it will be on there, sad or not to say.

So far I've seen nothing for days on TV about NAFTA or Rezko -- which means only the .01% of the population who blog know or care.

As for me, all I need to know at this point is that Hillary voted for the worst of Bush's agenda and Obama didn't. 

(And amusingly, McCain is now saying that his vote to invade Iraq is "history." Where have we heard that before?) 

I have never seen it posted here that Obama is perfect, nor that he can walk on water.  Obama has stated himself he is not perfect, that he makes mistakes.  However, I think this NAFTA story is being embellished by the Clintons and the press.  Also why was Goolsbee invited to a meeting?  Seems suspicious to me.

 ''It all boils down to a clumsy, inaccurate portrayal of the conversation.''

which is of course confirmation that the Goolsbee conversation did take place

still no advantage Clinton though (now if only Edwards was still in the race, lol) 

I agree why is being a Muslim negative?  I have many Muslim friends, can you imagine how they feel when they hear these stories.  I'm glad Barack said the stories were unfair to Muslims.

that folks are all worked up over the NAFTA meeting but ignoring the fact that Mark Penn and Charlie Black have such strong ties and would mutually benefit from a Hillary or McCain win just blows my mind.

I have to work today, probably a good thing, as I'm a nervous wreck.  Wanted to post this article from The Australian about HRCs shrinking crowds.  According to this story even if she ekes out close wins in Ohio and TX, she still will not be in good shape.

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,23313346-2703,00.html

Well, I just saw a report about the Rezko thing on TV. The reporter pointed out right up front that Obama did nothing illegal. After that it was just empty speculation whether it would hurt him politically. A real yawn.

John Edwards adviser endorses Obama.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/leo-hindery-jr/why-im-endorsing-barack-_b_89487.html

Denise - I just went back to that website and I can't connect now either - maybe everyone's thinking about assho!e this morning!

I once was fishing with a guy from the paper plant in Fort Francis and he was explaining how they piped wood slurry to either the plant on the Canadian side or the one in International Falls Minnesota and they would make the paper products in one country or the other based on currency values more than any other cause.

the Bush tax cuts causing the deficit which have bombed the dollar will keep Canada from dumping products into America( just the ground up trees), so we are temporily safe from Canadian trade threats

the exception right now is the high prices for the spring grains they feed their pigs are causing a massive liquidation of their hog herd being dumped on our markets as they bail out of feeding pigs, but that will be temporary cause once Jimmy Dean gets his hand on a sow no more baby piglets

Remember what those ditto heads did to the Dixie Chicks.

June 07, 2006: Dixie Chicks Retain Lead On Billboard 200

I hope the Chicks sent them a thank you note. 

Jo

I'm glad I clicked on it when I did, thanks for that perfect addition to where that whole sordid conversation was leading. put it back in proper perspective

 maybe everyone's thinking about assho!e this morning!

~~~~~~~~~~~~

so where is Cheney anyway?

Phil wrote "which is of course confirmation that the Goolsbee conversation did take place."

Are you referring to a report that Goolsbee denied the conversation took place?  The AP report doesn't allude to any denials.  There have been more than one CTV report, referring either to a phone call to a Canadian ambassador and to the consulate meeting.  What is your understanding of what denial refers to what report?

 agree why is being a Muslim negative?  I have many Muslim friends, can you imagine how they feel when they hear these stories.  I'm glad Barack said the stories were unfair to Muslims.  

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

You people havent figure it out yet ?...........its called 911hangover........understandable to a certain point somewhat like just after Pearl harbour and this countires treatment of Japanese/Amerocan citizens..........to a much lesser extent German and Italians..................

There are some other stereotypes from that region, but I shall not get into that right now......

Well, it's so nice to be loved. And I see Denise can't get me off her mind as she wishes to bring her discussion of me and now even twist (no surprise) the actuall facts to ever thread since the original discussion took place.

So here, lets grace this thread with what keeps her interest.


BTW...thank you all for advising me I've missed much discussion and name calling of myself on my absence here. I'm not nice, I'm racist, I'm a pod person. Some folks act like I scorned them personallly and can't shake....kind of like the irrational hatred of Hillary exhibited here.

I know, I know...darn, don't bring up facts. More names will come flying.



"34.

* rdorgan
Sun, 03/02/08



4:10 PM EST
16.
Linda in NM
Sun, 03/02/08
...I'll stay off the Obama blog that dfa has become. Too small a group for me to fit in with.



CIAO!+++Good things come in small packages. One day you may figure that out.


_____________________________________

What an @ssh***. But, no surprise there, huh?

It depends on the small package. Small brains are not usually a good thing.



Thank you my opportunity to join this ongoing conversation, but I'm sure the rest on this blog would like to stop now.


CiAO!

My response to the non-Rezko story: Norman Hsu.

Repeat after me: Clinton wins blowout wins tomorrow.

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/3...

Why is the media moving the goalposts for Clinton?

Linda wrote "I very much dislike the DLC as most on this list could probably agree with. I was thrilled when Al Gore disassociated himself from them afterhe lost in 2000. I wish Democrats didn't find them as a powerful group they felt the need to align themselves with. I truly dislike a group of people trying to claim for a Democrat to win, they need to be more Republican like. I don't like their policies, Privatizing School, Privatizing Social Security, Pro War, Pro supply and demand and Freetrade. Al From and Bruce Reed, the Founders, President and CEO of DLC...and now Harold Ford Jr, the Chair."

You neglected to add the Chair of the DLC American Dream Initiative.  She's the one to the left of Al From.

Linda wrote "What an @ssh***. But, no surprise there, huh?"

Oh my!  This means Phil will be reproducing the User Conduct code here any minute.

Linda NM I've been mean too -- I am sorry -- you pressed my hot button a few times -- and you're right -- the guy is not Superman.

BTW...thank you all for advising me I've missed much discussion and name calling of myself on my absence here. I'm not nice, I'm racist, I'm a pod person. Some folks act like I scorned them personallly and can't shake....kind of like the irrational hatred of Hillary exhibited here.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Linda,

No, you are none of the above .....just another person, to go along with us other celebrities that dont buy the Obama stuff entirely..........you are simply in an elite group including the likes of Al Gore and Jimmy Carter that simply wont jump on the bandwagon.............I, for one am donating a chunk of change towards the Obama campaign that Ill be enjoying on a nice caribbean beach.........all inclusive

In other words......my money stays in my pocket.......the country will go on just fine........regardless...

Keep your chin up........

Well, he's usually much faster than this, but it should be any second now.  Who will know how long the delay was without a time stamp, anyway?

Why is the media moving the goalposts for Clinton?

because they''ve gotten it wrong so many times already - BIG wrong like in NH!!  they're gun shy.  

Mike wrote "you are simply in an elite group including the likes of Al Gore and Jimmy Carter that simply wont jump on the bandwagon............."

I'm intrigued by your choice of the term "bandwagon."  After all, once the Gore, Edwards and Clinton ships have sailed, there aren't that many more bandwagons left on which to jump.  Hope I didn't accidently leave out Gravel and Dodd.

you are simply in an elite group including the likes of Al Gore and Jimmy Carter that simply wont jump on the bandwagon.........

Actually, LindaNM jumps from one bandwagon to another like a trapeze act. I assume she'll jump on Obama's too eventually. 

so where is Cheney anyway?

He doesn't get out much these days.

I know, I know...darn, don't bring up facts.

Bringing up facts is fine. Spreading manure isn't. 

Looks like Mark Penn is distancing himself from HRC campaign.

Senior Clinton campaign strategist Mark "Penn said in an e-mail over the weekend that he had 'no direct authority in the campaign,' describing himself as merely 'an outside message advisor with no campaign staff reporting to me.'

http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/03/like-ships-from.html

I very much dislike the DLC as most on this list could probably agree with.

Looks like Mark Penn is distancing himself from HRC campaign.

yeah, Clinton has distracted folks from the Penn story by blowing up the NAFTA story, yet the two have a much different impact on the democratic race.  she would do well to rid herself of him completely before that blows up, but the ties are so long and so old that I don't think they'll be able to shake them..

Well, you would have thought that Phil would be reproducing the User Conduct code here any minute.  He must save them for just those special occasions.

Linda if you think I liked seeing you, who supposedly always is above the fray here, calling rdorgan a "curse word", you're very wrong. And especially him whose only "offense", as I see it, is to support someone others do not. I was surprised to see you post it, and equally surprised to see Phil not respond to it, as he has admonished me and others here for lesser offenses.

That's what that was all about. I also complimented you upthread about bringing info here about an Obama advisor and spokeperson. I have no vendetta against you or anyone - just looking for the fairness Phil likes to point out to other adults that post here.

Phil....

If one thinks about our country, the choice for VP would be Dean. It is also a stepping stone for him to the presidency. Our country could use a Dr. in the WH for sixteen years.

Expressions of other choices, like "a woman" for VP, or Howard needs to stay at DNC, or he would be good as a cabinet member for health care, are in my opinion short sighted.

Someone like Dean comes along once in fifty years or so. We started out trying to get him elected president. Now, the way has been cleared for that to happen and we will be trying to elect somebody else. However, the opportunity is there if we would grab on to it, to get Howard to the presidency as the VP choice now.

He shouldn't be hidden in some other thankless job. We need the best talents we have leading the country.

The Gov. of Fl would make minced meat of Sibelius. Dodd, a good man, didn't do very well in his own campaign, Hagel would lose a lot of progressives. They are all second string to Howard, and he is the one we should concentrate on. I can't believe that isn't a unanimous and excited decision on this blog, but then this blog hasn't been very animated about much of anything for a while except directing attacks at anything that moves close by.

To be fair, Tom, he may be out in the fields. But thanks for getting what I was saying about it - and still no apology to rdorgan.....sigh.

New Thread:

http://www.blogforamerica.com/view/24068

Danny
Communications Director

Well, you would have thought that Phil would be reproducing the User Conduct code here any minute.  He must save them for just those special occasions.

Like when someone tells another, "you suck"? 

59. BWAhahahaha

Alse, erm, NEW THREAD.

Denise wrote "To be fair, Tom, he may be out in the fields."

Yes, but what's strange is how it is Phil decides when the time is right to come in.  You'll notice, from Sitka's link, that he took two instances of quotations from Josh Frank, one posted by Huron John and one by me as a repudiation, that were both on the same thread, but leapt to excoriate one of us for it.   He wasn't out in the fields for the other one.

ROFLMAO - so Linda doesn't believe that Hillary is more than just a 'member' of NDOL - of the DLC?  click on over and watch ofr her photo to appear at top of page as one of their 'leaders'.

http://www.ndol.org/

and then there's this - can it be much clearer?  do you know what the goals and policies of the DLC and of Hillary really are, Linda?  just asking.

http://www.ndol.org/ndol_ka.cfm?kaid=137

and still no apology to rdorgan.....sigh.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

It's okay, Denise, I've been waiting for nearly two mon