The Deans, DFA and the DFA Grassroots are always first!

Let's hear it for DFA Radio!

September 25, 2007 Op-Ed Columnist The Center Holds By DAVID BROOKS

In the beginning of August, liberal bloggers met at the YearlyKos convention while centrist Democrats met at the Democratic Leadership Council’s National Conversation. Almost every Democratic presidential candidate attended YearlyKos, and none visited the D.L.C.

At the time, that seemed a sign that the left was gaining the upper hand in its perpetual struggle with the center over the soul of the Democratic Party. But now it’s clear that was only cosmetic.

Now it’s evident that if you want to understand the future of the Democratic Party you can learn almost nothing from the bloggers, billionaires and activists on the left who make up the “netroots.” You can learn most of what you need to know by paying attention to two different groups — high school educated women in the Midwest, and the old Clinton establishment in Washington.

In the first place, the netroots candidates are losing. In the various polls on the Daily Kos Web site, John Edwards, Barack Obama and even Al Gore crush Hillary Clinton, who limps in with 2 percent to 10 percent of the vote.

Moguls like David Geffen have fled for Obama. But the party as a whole is going the other way. Hillary Clinton has established a commanding lead.

Second, Clinton is drawing her support from the other demographic end of the party. As the journalist Ron Brownstein and others have noted, Democratic primary contests follow a general pattern. There are a few candidates who represent the affluent, educated intelligentsia (Eugene McCarthy, Bill Bradley) and they usually end up getting beaten by the candidate of the less educated, lower middle class.

That’s what’s happening again. Obama and Edwards get most of their support from the educated, affluent liberals. According to Gallup polls, Obama garners 33 percent support from Democratic college graduates, 28 percent from those with some college and only 19 percent with a high school degree or less. Hillary Clinton’s core support, on the other hand, comes from those with less education and less income — more Harry Truman than Howard Dean.

Third, Clinton has established this lead by repudiating the netroots theory of politics. As the journalist Matt Bai makes clear in his superb book, “The Argument,” the netroots emerged in part in rebellion against Clintonian politics. They wanted bold colors and slashing attacks. They didn’t want their politicians catering to what Markos Moulitsas Zúniga of the Daily Kos calls “the mythical middle.”

But Clinton has relied on Mark Penn, the epitome of the sort of consultant the netroots reject, and Penn’s approach has been entirely vindicated by the results so far.

In a series of D.L.C. memos with titles like “The Decisive Center,” Penn has preached that while Republicans can win by appealing only to conservatives, Democrats must appeal to centrists as well as liberals. In his new book, “Microtrends,” he casts a caustic eye on the elites and mega-donors of both parties who are out of touch with average voter concerns.

Fourth, the netroots are losing the policy battles. As Matt Bai’s reporting also suggests, the netroots have not been able to turn their passion and animus into a positive policy agenda. Democratic domestic policy is now being driven by old Clinton hands like Gene Sperling and Bruce Reed.

And while Clinton may not go out of her way to offend the MoveOn types, on her TV rounds on Sunday she made it obvious that she’s not singing their tune.

On “This Week With George Stephanopoulos,” Clinton could have vowed to vacate Iraq. Instead, she delivered hawkish mini-speeches that few Republicans would object to. She listed a series of threats and interests in the region and made it clear that she’d be willing to keep U.S. troops there to handle them.

The fact is, many Democratic politicians privately detest the netroots’ self-righteousness and bullying. They also know their party has a historic opportunity to pick up disaffected Republicans and moderates, so long as they don’t blow it by drifting into cuckoo land. They also know that a Democratic president is going to face challenges from Iran and elsewhere that are going to require hard-line, hawkish responses.

Finally, these Democrats understand their victory formula is not brain surgery. You have to be moderate on social issues, activist but not statist on domestic issues and hawkish on foreign policy. This time they’re not going to self-destructively deviate from that.

Both liberals and Republicans have an interest in exaggerating the netroots’ influence, but in reality that influence is surprisingly marginal, even among candidates for whom you’d think it would be strong.

Several weeks ago, I asked John Edwards what the YearlyKos event was like. He couldn’t remember which event I was talking about, and looked over to an aide for help.

Clinton/Bayh 2008

2. David

Just heard Reid on Ahmadinejad:  “As goofy as he seems to be  in his ‘speech’. …..

Ho-ly-cow…how disheartening.   I guess “nobody ever bothers to kick a ‘dead horse” is a good explanation for some of this....or more likely,  FEAR of not going along with the Bush media put downs...and being jumped on.  FEAR.  Wouldn't it be nice to have just one real human being (gutsy) Democrat say -- "it's good to listen and learn and be polite, afterall, we're the ones pushing 'freedom of speech'.     Anyone?

 Obviously, the Republicans and even some Democrats are afraid to have him speak.   Interesting.  One honest reporter on MSNBC said to Tucker Carlson – that even students who didn’t think they’d be impressed – were impressed with him.  And he gave them things to think about.     CNN gave it all away when saying “His speech at the UN…didn’t name names, just said …’arrogant’…’oppressors’…’occupiers’…’wiretappers’..”human rights violaters’…so you KNEW he meant the U.S.  That would almost be funny, if it weren't so TRUE.

2. David Brooks is an egregiously dishonest propagandist for the hard right, so it's disappointing to see his garbage reprinted here as something that should be taken seriously.

The quote"Now it’s evident that if you want to understand the future of the Democratic Party you can learn almost nothing from the bloggers, billionaires and activists on the left who make up the “netroots.”  is pure neocon spin.

Once again, remember that in September of 2003, Howard Dean had an "insurmountable lead".

I can't think of a worse Democratic Slate than Clinton/Bayh-- a complete rejection of the Democratic Base, which sooner or later is going to stop rushing to the support of whichever GOP-Lite candidates the Democratic Establishment decides to stuff down our throats.

73.S. Jackson

.......new thread has been up for 30 minutes, your reporting is not being watched
================

Thanks

Hello,

Just stopping in to check mail.

HERE'S THE SUMMARY OF THE LAST 30 MINUTES - PRESENTLY THERE IS A LULL IN ACTIVITY - MAY BE READING AMENDMENTS AND/OR VOTING.

Warner may want an amendment. Biden speaks on amendments.
Levin says amendments "not in order at this moment." Kerry may want to make an amendment. Biden thanks Kerry for his leadership. Some changes have been made.

Some changes:

1. Kyl wanted statements added - "Central focus of Al Qaeda..."
2. [bring us later]
3. Statement "Not be forcing on Iraq anything inconsistent with their wishes, in compliance with their Constition"
4. Statement "Nothing in this...will impose on the sovereignity of the nation of Iraq" Warner wants, "sovereignty" word put in specifically.

Levin speaks on Biden's own amendment - remarks that this Iraq Federalism is their own, reflected in their own Iraqi Constition, as it is, or as it will be amended by the Iraqis. This Federalism allows for the establishment of States as it is their system for their own country, designed by them....not imposed, but they have fashioned, adapted, and designed themselves..

Kyl has objections that language was not his, and that it was a mistake to attribute that language to him.

Biden apologizes. Vote may be tomorrow. Leiberman may want amendment. Biden would like a vote tonite or by 10:00 tomorrow.

Biden-Boxer-Brownback is actually an amendment to the Defense Authorization Bill. 34. Amendmendments are within that Amendment. Pause in activity. Not sure what it is

OMG, this gives me hope that this young 2 year old will be our country's future AWARE citizens.

Have a look at this smart little girl.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r43yCiKlbCo&eurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Eflabber%2Enl%2Farchief%2F021665%2Ephp 

Happy Birthday David Stevenson

AAISVGTBHAF

...is that right David?  :) 

NO VOTES TONITE IN SENATE. may be vote on BBB amendment to Defense authorization bill tonite.

Sorry - I meant

may be vote on BBB amendment to Defense authorization bill tonite TOMORROW BY 10:00 - MAYBE NOT.

You can learn most of what you need to know by paying attention to two different groups — high school educated women in the Midwest, and the old Clinton establishment in Washington."

************************************* 

I thought he had his tongue in his cheek, but what he's saying is that good sturdy Lutheran relatively uneducated women from IA are going to give it to the CM.  Phil already told us that the women are going for  the CM and why wouldn't they?  It's a backlash IMO.

I  remember hearing a little old lady saying she'd vote for Kerry becuz he has such beautiful hair...a guy I know said, "He looks presidential."  

Go figure.

We need licenses to drive, to get married, to open a business, to practice law....perhaps we should have licenses to vote....a quiz not unlike that given to prospective citizens..something, anything to prove that the voter knows more than some apparently now do .

Good grief. 

Thune speaking against HATE CRIMES amendment to DA bill.

If we want to know who's influencing the CMWs, just look at the coverage....right wing most all the way...the neo-con PNAC AIPAC defense corp agenda.

And now many many kids are not even graduating from high school.  How easily manipulated they are. 

It's one thing for me to call bush a putz and quite another for public figures to bash Ahmadinejab...his remark about gays....how do we know the translator translated correctly...or even impartially?  It's almost impossible to translate the letter of the law and slang doesn't ever translate.

Frankly, most of his criticisms of the US are true.  He's not the "kook" some misguided person said he is.  Certainly no more crazed and crazy than the occupants of our BH.

Makes me wonder about Kim Jong il.  All we know is what our awful press tells us about him.   Gullible trusting Americans.....getting us into massive trouble.

How do we stop the CM?  IA could start........ 

CM = Clinton Machine

CMW = corporate media wh@@es.  Maybe that's too confusing.

HM Hillary machine? HM = Hell Machine? 

Also, humor does not translate well, and I sense that Ahmadinejab has a dry/wry sense of humor. 

Ammanpour interviews Ahmadinejad tomorrow night CNN

That should be excellent. 

Uh oh, this is not good at all.

William Fisher | US Ally Thumbs Nose at Its Biggest Donor
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/092507R.shtml
Writing for Truthout, William Fisher says: "Despite a US Congressional warning exempting American democracy-promotion funds from having to obtain prior approval from the Egyptian government, the Mubarak regime - a major recipient of US aid and hailed by the Bush administration as a staunch ally in the 'global war on terror' - has shut down one of the country's premiere human rights organizations."

I think Pelosi is coming up on Blitzer.  Not sure I want to listen to her s*it.

Is there another thread?  Where is everybody?

Don't these CMWs know about 41?  Blitzer isn't putting it to Pelosi.

And she keeps talking about the 60 votes. 

drive by..........

19. Oh, I agree with that.

But, on a serious note, since when is the homophobia that he displayed in his speech, claiming they don't have gays, grounds for the lashing that we've seen. I mean, no one seems to treat the Republicants that way. Or are they excused because folks no that they are actually living lies in the closet? So that makes all their hatred and removal of rights and fairnes all OK?

I understand there are claims of improper treatment towards gays, the young, other religions, etc, but that's not what is being discussed, is it? As a matter of fact, he got BOOED when he said they "didn't have..." ISn't that a bit ridiculous. A bit over dramatic?

Two words, Senator Craig.

OK, now I finally understand why the dems are not doing anything.

The idea is to keep blaming bush and keep the war going and keep the citizens angry so that come 08 CLINTON IS ASSURED A WIN. The Clinton machine is behind this do-nothing sorry excuse of a dem congress.  This is a diabolical plan and to hell with the soldiers dying and being maimed.

Watching Pelosi just now cleared it all up for me.  They don't want to  end the occupation.  And now I'm thinking of the cozy relationship between the Bushes and Clintons. Shudder  

This has been planned for a long time....a bush/clinton dynasty.

There is a flaw in this diabolical plan.  I'm not gonna vote for her. 

And how in the hell can clinton MAKE us buy insurance?  What about the people who don't even  have money for food? 

Al Gore on Blitzie tomorrow!

OK, time to jump in, Al. 

"There are  no gays in Iran" is WHAT THE TRANSLATOR SAID.

Get real people.  Learn a language and see how well you can simultaneously translate. 

Who was the translator?  For god's sake, if he was a crony of the idiot Bollinger...........or whatever his name is.......... 

I'm totally paranoid.  There are RW nutjobs in every nook and cranny.  LOL

It looks like Kyl- Lieberman non-binding resolution probably will pass. It is nauseating to see liberal Dems talking like right-wingers because of the AIPAC factor.

sEA....yES

bLITZER: yOUR BASE WANTS YOU TO IMPEACH. iS THAT STILL OFF THE TABLE?

PELOSI: IT'S ALWAYS BEEN OFF THE TABLE. THIS IS BUSH'S WAR NOW.

HUH?

27.seashell :-)

Al Gore on Blitzie tomorrow!
OK, time to jump in, Al.
"There are no gays in Iran" is WHAT THE TRANSLATOR SAID.
Get real people. Learn a language and see how well you can simultaneously translate
==================

I agree. I am very suspicious that it was a translation mistake. Like so many other things he has said that are paraphrased incorrectly. I am not defending Ahmadinejad, but I don't believe in slander used on friends or enemies.

I hope everyone's watching Keith..or watched.

I like Jane Harmon much more than Pelosi or Feingold and I'm not very keen on Boxer anymore.  That Moveon. petition soured me. 

anti-moveon Boxer amend or petition or whatever thing they called it.

I call it unconstitutional. 

Ahmadinehad talking about the travails of Palestinians on C-Span now at UN - may be previous recording.

http://www.c-span.org/watch/cs_cspan2_wm...

33.seashell :-)

anti-moveon Boxer amend or petition or whatever thing they called it

=============
Don't agree with lots of stuff Congressional and Senate Democrats do - but MoveOn is moving out of the mainstream IMO - they used to be good but they are moving towards self-serving self-righteousness with total disregard for political realities. This will hurt Democrats more from within that the neocons or greens ever could.

MoveOn is on my $hit list.

LINDA*in*SFNM ~

This seems right up your alley!!!

Check it out!!  :-)  

http://www.democrats.org/page/community/group/GoreDean2008/ 

Move-on called it like it is.

if Admiral William Fallon, chief of the(US) Central Command (Centcom) can call
Betrayus a " an ass-kissing little chickenshit", then whats wrong with
move-on position ?

listener, thank you. Excellent.

Things are looking gOOOOD! :)


Time for a COOL change,
Gore
2008

listener, I'm moving to my new home, I've wanted to share with you...did you know I will be living on "Angel Peak" :)

DAVID BROOKS you an insolent slut !

Did you read one of the other op-eds on the same page?

[...]

The G.O.P. has spent the last 40 years insulting, disenfranchising and otherwise stomping on the interests of black Americans. Last week, the residents of Washington, D.C., with its majority black population, came remarkably close to realizing a goal they have sought for decades — a voting member of Congress to represent them.

[...]

At the same time that the Republicans were killing Congressional representation for D.C. residents, the major G.O.P. candidates for president were offering a collective slap in the face to black voters nationally by refusing to participate in a long-scheduled, nationally televised debate focusing on issues important to minorities.

[...]

...the mother of Andrew Goodman, one of the three young civil rights activists shot to death by rabid racists near Philadelphia, Miss., in 1964.

Dr. Goodman, one of the most decent people I have ever known, carried the ache of that loss with her every day of her life.

In one of the vilest moves in modern presidential politics, Ronald Reagan, the ultimate hero of this latter-day Republican Party, went out of his way to kick off his general election campaign in 1980 in that very same Philadelphia, Miss. He was not there to send the message that he stood solidly for the values of Andrew Goodman. He was there to assure the bigots that he was with them.

“I believe in states’ rights,” said Mr. Reagan. The crowd roared.

In 1981, during the first year of Mr. Reagan’s presidency, the late Lee Atwater gave an interview to a political science professor at Case Western Reserve University, explaining the evolution of the Southern strategy:

“You start out in 1954 by saying, ‘Nigger, nigger, nigger,’ ” said Atwater. “By 1968, you can’t say ‘nigger’ — that hurts you. Backfires. So you say stuff like forced busing, states’ rights, and all that stuff. You’re getting so abstract now [that] you’re talking about cutting taxes, and all these things you’re talking about are totally economic things, and a byproduct of them is [that] blacks get hurt worse than whites.”

[...]

Fred

Thank you for your excellent reporting from the Senate today.

37.chilimac

Move-on called it like it is.

================
Big Deal - so do a million other people. The headline was a mistake, but they wallowed in the publicity and made no statements to ameliorate the animosities.

They used to have more class than that.

Bhutto speaking at UN on C-span
http://www.c-span.org/watch/cs_cspan2_wm...

I saw Newt Grininggrinch on ABC this mornig

He was first asked about the coming debate on PBS at Howard University and MCed by tavis Smiley

he did a little intro dance and then in his "southern strategy" best

said, "Republicans could have a trmendous message"...

 http://www.abcnews.go.com/GMA/Decision2008/story?id=3646752&page=1

You have to hear this folks and remember Lee Atwater and the "southern strategy"

33.

It wasn't anti-MoveOn.

It merely said if MoveOn is going to get slapped, then we'll see you and raise you the two unconscionable attacks mounted by the mainstream GOP against Max Cleland and John Kerry.

Boxer even said in her remarks that official censure of an advertisement was ridiculous, and a violation of free speech. Her effort was merely to confront the GOP with its own hypocrisy.

The Betrayus stink bomb has created a path for MoveOn

"HM Hillary machine? HM = Hell Machine?"

How about "Her Majesty"?

I have to say, if we are presented with a Clinton-Bayh ticket, I will either be voting Ron Paul or moving to Canada.

31.

I believe Ahmadinejad said they had no gays in Iran "like in your country", meaning that gays in Iran have been systematically wiped out until any that remain understand they need to keep it in the closet.

If you think gayness is a sin to Christians, well, that's not a patch on what it is to Muslims.

BTW, Ahmadinejad hit another home run by asking why the US befriends the country where the attack against us originated, Saudi Arabia. Yeah, let's see a few more pictures of GWB holding hands with some Saudi sheikh.

"Not that there's anything wrong with that." ;-)

Well, that's my 2 cents for the night.

I walked to work today, 1 hr. each way, then worked on my feet another 8 hours. I feel like my ancestors, LOL.

Nite all.

"The War" has a lot of footage from Italy. Had an Uncle fight there, but my college philosophy prof. was in a unit where only he and two others were neither killed or wounded and was scarred for life.

bloggie is acting up and kicking me out at refresh

41.Phil Specht

Fred
Thank you for your excellent reporting from the Senate today
==============
Glad you enjoyed it - just got my 1.5 meg DSL - feel sorrow for you with the dial-up. Found a Zoom v.92 w v.44 compression at a yard sale for $3 last Saturday. It is a serial connection. They say those are the best. My daughter or I can use it as a second connection. have not tested it yet but it powers up.

48.volney simmons
31.

I believe Ahmadinejad said they had no gays in Iran "like in your country", meaning that gays in Iran have been systematically wiped out until any that remain understand they need to keep it in the closet.

=============
Maybe, but I think he meant it in a little softer sense, rather than "wiped out" I don't think he was talking about extermination.

When he said "...like you do" he probably meant, "...openly and casually claiming to be homosexuals, like you have in America"

Clinton-Bayh??? Yuk! Gross!!! I would have to vote for Romney I think.

The War was gripping again. I cried. What a wonderful family Babe Ciarlo had. And when they bombed the hell out of that 6th !!!! C Benedictine monestery. And the Germans weren't even using it. And the Germans held their fire while the Americans played baseball. I wonder if Anzio was just a decoy for the troops coming into Rome from the sea? And that black historian who tried to sign up with a PhD frm Harvard and typing and shorthand but they wouldn't take him b/c he was black. lol. And the Japanese guy in Mobile on the bus -- went to sit in the back with the blacks and they guided him up with the whites. He didn't know what to do. Ah America -- warts and all and you have quite a few -- gotta love ya.

10 hours ago

WASHINGTON (AFP) — The US House of Representatives aimed a sharp jab at Iran's President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad Tuesday, slapping new energy sanctions on Tehran, and branding its Revolutionary Guard a terrorist group.

A measure targeting the elite military corps and the lucrative Iranian energy sector sailed through the House by 397 votes to 16, hours before Ahmadinejad's speech to the United Nations General Assembly.

The legislation is aimed at depriving Iran of proceeds from energy sales which could be diverted into funding its nuclear program, which the West says is intended to produce atomic weapons, a charge Tehran denies.

Its top sponsor, veteran Democratic chairman of the House Foreign Affairs committee, Tom Lantos, said the bill was needed because Iran's denials of a nuclear weapons program could not be believed

54. hell s/b h*ll -- sorry.

The set up...

A Russian Conspiracy Theory..

Iran has OIL, it also has large deposits of URANIUM.  China depends heavily on Iran’s oil.  The War on Iran was supposed to start in 2006.  Iran showed it’s weapon’s force and the war was backed off – supposed to start in May 2007….. Something happened.