Home » The Watercooler for 08/31/08 5:00 PM
The Watercooler for 08/31/08 5:00 PM
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To go after a woman and her children, a disabled child at that, for political purposes is disgusting. that is what they do, not us. Your innuendos are sick. Disagree with her policy, state it, but try to leave out the demonization of a woman because she is struck with a DS child. The is plenty of room at Kos for that kind of crap. Tip of iceburg! What next, she wet the bed as a child, stuttered, had a daughter get detention. For goodness sake.
- Her dad shot a moose out of season and she shared the illicit meat.
By Phil Specht on Aug 31, 2008 6:01 PM EDT.
shares a place in history with Clarence Thomas. You Republicans go out of your way to find someone unqualified as a token choice.
Think about what she did. Her water breaks in Texas when the baby is still premature. Then she decides to take an 8 hour flight to Alaska to deliver her high risk baby.
Personally, I'm thinking these actions border on criminal.
These rumors are lame grocery market checkout fare. I'm much more interested in pregnancy public policy.
McCain's vice presidential candidate would force, by government authority, every pregnant woman, married or single, to carry her baby to term regardless of how serious or tragic a birth defect the baby might have, no matter the risk to the mother, and no matter the consequences to the mother and child as a result of the circumstances of birth.
Consistently applying the logic that life begins at conception, this edict would include all teenage incest and rape victims. Upon conviction, all doctors who perform abortions would be guilty of the capital offense of murder in the first degree, the fertilized egg having the same status as that of a person born alive. Fertility specialists performing in vitro fertilization would be committing mass murder by destroying the fertilized eggs that aren't implanted.
She announced her pregnancy when she was already supposedly 7 months along. At that time, she also said she didn't expect to miss any time from work because she was expecting everything to go well.
Should any woman expect things to "go well" when your already know you're having a baby with Downs?
My wife's best friend is an OB and she say that there is no more or less risk during delivery with a DS child than any other child. Any other criminal allegations you wish to make against a mother of five. Get back to policy, WE ARE NOT KOS!!!!
There's something offensive to me about the whole theme of this subthread -- I myself said last night that it didn't seem in best interest of the mom or baby to take that long plane ride but 1) maybe it was a private plane with an MD and 2) maybe she wasn't even preggers it was her daughter.
But all that aside, you fellows talking about criminality and such in regard to a pregnant woman's activity borders on those fundy guys talking about arresting pregnant women for various behaviors -- I guess to me it will become your business when you start giving birth yourselves.
A township on Long Island, NY where I grew up, has a current population of 762.000. Alaska's population is under 700,000. Nobody would suggest the Supervisor of the township is qualified to be VP.
Nothing against her (the Supervisor).
...I don't see it as a political cover up as much as a Mom protecting her unwed teenage daughter...if the stories are true...but how many healthy teenaged girls give birth to Down's babies -- I thought it mostly occurred in older mothers.
...Is anyone besides me hooked on 'The Secret Life of the American Teenager' it's somewhere between an excellent soap and a really good show -- I think the characters run true to form - the only thing is I want to tell any 'would be' teen Moms that "Ben"s don't exist in real life (the knocked up girl has Ben fall madly in love with her and wants to marry her and be the Dad to the baby.)
simply brilliant! the obama ad people did one with a tech-altered sam cook tune. the new lyrics were about economic hardships--gas, for instance--but the unique sound of sam cook's voice connected me to my youth. i'm sure it was intended to speak to older voters about their youth and idealism through the music of that time in their lives.
hats off to you guys!
so..........her water broke, and palin hastened to take a flight back to alaska to have her 5th child born in her beloved state. after 4 kids, she might have known that when the water breaks, there is a higher likelihood of introducing infection into the less protected womb. the average airport is not exactly aseptic.
if she were indeed pregnant, her low level of critical thinking scares me.
A few things occur to me about the approaching storm.
This is a "do-over" for everyone involved. It's a time to show what was learned during Katrina and a chance to prove that everyone can do what it is needed.
However, it is also a no win situation. In order to get people to evacuate, the mayor of NO seems to be over dramatic in his statements...that could come back to haunt him.
- Gustav will hook west, it depends on how far north first for Lake Pochartrain and the levees
By Phil Specht on Aug 31, 2008 6:43 PM EDTLaFayette is the place I'd worry about the most from the latest track.Can't see leaving NOLA to go there. The Salvation Army did a better job than the Red Cross responding to Katrina in Baton Rouge.
- I like that the Navajo Code Talkers presented the colors
By floridagal . on Aug 31, 2008 6:40 PM EDTat the convention. I did not see it live, so I was glad to find these pictures. Also a good picture of Howard Dean in Rapid City in 2006 honoring one of them.
Code Talkers honored at the Democratic Convention.
HURRICANE GUSTAV FORECAST/ADVISORY NUMBER 29
NWS TPC/NATIONAL HURRICANE CENTER MIAMI FL AL072008
2100 UTC SUN AUG 31 2008
AT 4 PM CDT...2100 UTC...THE HURRICANE WARNING IS EXTENDED WESTWARD
ALONG THE LOUISIANA AND TEXAS COASTS TO JUST EAST OF HIGH ISLAND
TEXAS. A HURRICANE WARNING IS NOW IN EFFECT FROM JUST EAST OF HIGH
ISLAND EASTWARD TO THE ALABAMA-FLORIDA BORDER...INCLUDING THE CITY
OF NEW ORLEANS AND LAKE PONTCHARTRAIN. A HURRICANE WARNING MEANS
THAT HURRICANE CONDITIONS ARE EXPECTED WITHIN THE WARNING AREA
WITHIN THE NEXT 24 HOURS. PREPARATIONS TO PROTECT LIFE AND
PROPERTY SHOULD BE RUSHED TO COMPLETION
FORECAST POSITIONS AND MAX WINDS
INITIAL 31/2100Z 26.4N 87.3W 100 KT
12HR VT 01/0600Z 27.9N 88.9W 110 KT
24HR VT 01/1800Z 29.4N 90.9W 100 KT...INLAND
if Gustav travels west over water it will do the most damage with a left hook, some models still show that
more storm surge into the levee system
they are doing the right thing ordering the evacuation, but missing NOLA doesn't mean people won't need help, since many folks live paycheck to paycheck and most will do without one that get paid by the hour, and no one should think sleeping on a cot with thousands of others is anything but a trial, and houses will be destroyed
The one thing that bothers me (as a mom) with reference to the rumor mill about Sarah Palin's pregnancy is this: Her daughter is just 17 years old and it sure isn't too cool to insinuate that she is the mother of the young infant if it's just a rumor - since when do we involve children? Just sayin' at this moment it's gossip.
Now the one part of the story that bothers me immensely is if indeed her amniotic fluid broke in TX - she is negligent in taking that flight to AK. And no doctor would tell her it's okay to do so. I've been through this myself and was immediately hospitalized due to the high risk of infection which could be catastrophic to the newborn. In my book that is pro-life.
So the repugs want to use Gustav for political purposes. What else is new. What a bunch of sick SOBs.
http://voices.washingtonpost.com/thefix/2008/08/gauging_gustavs_political_impa.html
For those talking heads claiming Barack has no executive experience. He most certainly has, he has ran a very successful campaign for many months.
For a rational voice.
I just thought I'd make a few medical points:
First, Governor Palin could have been close to 100% positive that her baby would have Down syndrome through non-invasive tests (nuchal translucency and early blood test; anomaly screen ultrasound.)
Second, through high level ultrasounds, the Governor could also be close to 100% positive that her baby, despite Down syndrome, did not have cardiac abnormalities or tracheoesophageal fistula, or hydrocephalus, in which case, she would not have to be in a high risk center to give birth safely.
(continued)
Third, her risk in flying to Alaska was not necessarily from infection (presuming that she knew that she was group B strep negative, a test her doctor might have done prior to her leaving for Texas), but in going into labor and delivering en route. If she was traveling with reasonable medical support, she was probably not taking an undue risk. She might even have been given IV antibiotics en route, which would be the standard in-hosptital procedure to minimize risk of infection to the baby.
Fourth, over half a Down syndrome babies are born to younger mothers. The risk per pregnancy of Down syndrome is higher in older women, but younger women have more babies. Down syndrome is usually a matter of genetic bad luck, and can happen at any age, even 16.
Robin from Maine
Third, her risk in flying to Alaska was not necessarily from infection (presuming that she knew that she was group B strep negative, a test her doctor might have done prior to her leaving for Texas), but in going into labor and delivering en route. If she was traveling with reasonable medical support, she was probably not taking an undue risk. She might even have been given IV antibiotics en route, which would be the standard in-hosptital procedure to minimize risk of infection to the baby.
Fourth, over half a Down syndrome babies are born to younger mothers. The risk per pregnancy of Down syndrome is higher in older women, but younger women have more babies. Down syndrome is usually a matter of genetic bad luck, and can happen at any age, even 16.
Let's discuss her politics and her qualifications, such as they are.
Robin from Maine
that she had been tested recently, when she didn't see a doctor until her 7th month of pregnancy?
my daughter in law was screened on a Thursday, had a start/stop 3 day labor over the weekend - they were monitoring her at home rather than admitting her. when her water broke they found she did, indeed have a fresh infection and thus ended up with the baby in NICU for 3 days.
yes, paine, Sara is just a distraction. but we certainly should consider the judgement - especailly about LIFE, of someone who wants to be 'one heartbeat away'.
Her dad shot a moose out of season and she shared the illicit meat.By Phil Specht
Big deal, half of Montana is guilty of that.
If it wasn't for poached deer we would have been real hungry in the 50s 60s and 70s.
Another rational voice.
He said his defence officials had told him the provocation was to benefit one of the US presidential candidates. <!-- E SF -->
Georgia tried to retake the Russian-backed separatist region of South Ossetia this month by force after a series of clashes.
Russian forces subsequently launched a counter-attack and the conflict ended with the ejection of Georgian troops from both South Ossetia and another rebel region, Abkhazia, and an EU-brokered ceasefire.
Diplomatic wrangling
Mr Putin said in the US television network interview: "The fact is that US citizens were indeed in the area in conflict during the hostilities.
"It should be admitted that they would do so only following direct orders from their leaders."
<!-- S IBOX -->
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Mr Putin added: "The American side in effect armed and trained the Georgian army.
"Why... seek a difficult compromise solution in the peacekeeping process? It is easier to arm one of the sides and provoke it into killing another side. And the job is done.
"The suspicion arises that someone in the United States especially created this conflict with the aim of making the situation more tense and creating a competitive advantage for one of the candidates fighting for the post of US president," he said.
Just heard a political (re-election) TV ad here in Massachusetts
for John Kerry (Senate re-election)
...the vice was Al Gore pitching for Kerry
Hurricane-4 GUSTAV (25 AUG-01 SEP)
Current - Max Winds: 100 Min Pres: 952 Category: 3
HURRICANE CENTER LOCATED NEAR 26.4N 87.3W AT 31/2100Z
POSITION ACCURATE WITHIN 15 NM
PRESENT MOVEMENT TOWARD THE NORTHWEST OR 320 DEGREES AT 16 KT
may be given from the area of the hurricane. I can't even fathom this.
When I heard that 'Cain selected a woman for his VP
I remarked that she must be a ballsy-woman,
because the party of hate and bigotry likes ballsy women.
personally...I like sexy woman. I know, not PC, but tat's the way I feel. (PRINT IT and REPEAT!).
Well, this is the second edit. I doubt it works!
so it will come down to GOTV
I don't pay too much attention to national polls, especially CNN. Looking at the EVs, it seems to me Obama/Biden is in fair shape.
- ...and speaking of hurricanes, Hanna is looking troublesome...
By Annilow on Aug 31, 2008 11:03 PM EDThttp://www.nhc.noaa.gov/refresh/graphics_at3+shtml/025514.shtml?5day#contents
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
For all the b*thcing I/we do about HQ around here, I think Tim has fixed: the toolbar so you always get one. And the 'edit' function is a real lifesaver (facesaver I guess).
.
you must live right I don't have an edit function unless I get a box that says "create" instead of submit comment
Looks like Gustav makes landfall tomorrow -- God bless the critters left behind in harm's way...
http://www.nhc.noaa.gov/refresh/graphics_at2+shtml/015746.shtml?3day#contents
If their water broke far away from home(s)?
Jeez, this line of attack on Palin slimes us all.
Look, Biden gets kudos for staying in the Senate and putting his family back together in the 70's. Job and Family best he could.
How about granting the Governor of Alaska the some lattitude about her Family and Career balancing act.
is putting the child at extreme risk - no maybe about it, she should have been hospitalized for observation at the very least, not hopping on a plane. the reason or circumstances don't matter - she made a choice that endangered that child and she was extremely reckless with that child's life.
this action puts the lie to her stance on abortion - you can't have it both ways! this woman was careless beyond reason with that life at the very moment it was entering this world.
if she wasn't really pregnant, it's a lie of a different color, but it's still a lie. this woman's judgement cannot be trusted. and that IS something we should be concerned with.
Some years ago when I discussed this with the OBGyn who was to deliver my firstborn, I found out the test would confirm or rule out Down syndrome, but it would give no indication of how disabling or mild the DS would be for the individual child.
So, if you're not going to abort - why have the test?
I would say forget it because it adds risks, it is significantly invasive procedure.
Some mothers, some families, want to know ahead of time.
Choice is best left to the families and, quite frankly, none of BFA-ers business.
I agree it is no one's business, and frankly I don't care.
But quite frankly I do not think it was right for Palin to use this precious little boy as a campaign ploy to get votes.
We are getting a very good rain/thunder/lightening storm right now. Flash flooding is possible in some areas due to some areas have had fires.
God speed to everyone in the path of the hurricane.
One Hundred Eighth Congress
of the
United States of America
AT THE SECOND SESSION
An Act
To reauthorize the INDIVIDUALS WITH DISABILITIES
EDUCATION ACT, and for other purposes.
Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives
of the United States of America in Congress assembled...
...
`(c) FINDINGS- Congress finds the following:
`(1) Disability is a natural part of the human experience
and in no way diminishes the right of individuals to
participate in or contribute to society. Improving
educational results for children with disabilities is
an essential element of our national policy of ensuring
equality of opportunity, full participation, independent
living, and economic self-sufficiency for individuals with
disabilities.
The reauthorization of IDEA will be coming up during the next Congress if they do it on time.
Please advocate for mandatory federal funding of the long authorized 40 percent federal share of the extra expenses for educating children with disabilities.
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- how did she know and when did she know it?
By pinsocal * on Aug 31, 2008 5:31 PM EDThow did palin know that she was carrying a down syndrome child, and when did she know it?
unless she knew by divine communication, she would have had to take a test[s] during her pregnancy--assuming she was pregnant. [btw, love all that stuff upthread about her.] those tests are considered by the right-wing to be pro-abortion 'search and destroy missions.'
if she did take one or more of those tests, why did she do so? women take the tests to inform their decisions to keep or abort their fetus.
if she did not take the test[s], why is she lying to the american people about 'choosing' to keep the child when she had no clinical data?
if we can believe the reports--down syndrome, premature, possibly low birth weight--where the f*** is her priority? d.s. babies have more than mental retardation. they might have cleft palates and congenital heart problems which must be corrected surgically in the first 12 months. tip of the iceberg.